Author Topic: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?  (Read 2079 times)

Offline Lone_woLf

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Polar Heat Bringing Harder Winters
By Stephen Leahy

OSLO, Jun 15, 2010 (IPS) - Last winter's big snowfall and cold temperatures in the eastern United States and Europe were likely caused by the loss of Arctic sea ice, researchers concluded at the International Polar Year Oslo Science Conference in Norway last week.

Climate change has warmed the entire Arctic region, melting 2.5 million square kilometres of sea ice, and that, paradoxically, is producing colder and snowier winters for Europe, Asia and parts of North America.

"The exceptional cold and snowy winter of 2009-2010 in Europe, eastern Asia and eastern North America is connected to unique physical processes in the Arctic," said James Overland of the NOAA/Pacific Marine Environmental Laboratory in the United States.

"In future, cold and snowy winters will be the rule rather than the exception" in these regions, Overland told IPS.

Scientists have been surprised by the rapid warming of the Arctic, where annual temperatures have increased two to three times faster than the global average. In one part of the Arctic, over the Barents and Karas Seas north of Scandinavia, average annual temperatures are now 10 degrees C higher than they were in 1990.

Overland explains the warming of the Arctic as the result of a combination of climate change, natural variability, loss of sea ice reflectivity, ocean heat storage and changing wind patterns, which has disrupted the stability of the Arctic climate system. In just 30 years, all that extra heat has shrunk the Arctic's thick blanket of ice by 2.5 million square kilometres - an area equivalent to more than one quarter the size of the continental U.S.

The changes in the Arctic are now irreversible, he said.

"This is a very big change for the entire planet," said David Barber, an Arctic climatologist at the University of Manitoba in Canada. The planet's cold polar regions are crucial drivers of Earth's weather and climate.

"It has been one million years, some think 14 million years, since the Arctic was ice-free," Barber told the more than 2,300 researchers in Oslo at the largest-ever gathering of the polar-science community.

The International Polar Year (IPY), which just ended with the Oslo Science conference last weekend, involved more than 50,000 scientists from 60 countries conducting 30 months of unprecedented research at both poles. The last IPY was 50 years ago and led to the creation of the Antarctic Treaty to protect the southern polar region.

"Much of the remaining ice in the Beaufort Sea is rotten," said Barber, who spent long periods on research icebreakers in the region. Such vessels can only break through ice a little over a metre thick but they were plowing through multi-year ice 14 metres thick, he said.

"We watched a piece of ice the size of Manhattan break up right before our eyes," Barber said.

Although the ice recovers in winter and satellites recorded a full recovery this past winter, in reality much of it was a thin layer of ice on top of old rotten ice, he said. That explains the rapid decline already this year, a near-record low for May. At the end of the Arctic summer, the decline will likely come close to setting another new record, many here said.

Barber says an ice-free summer may be just three or four years away, when icebreakers will no longer be needed to navigate the region.

"The ice pack looks like Swiss cheese," agreed Mark Serreze, a senior research scientist at the National Snow and Ice Data Centre in Boulder, Colorado.

"It is inescapable this will be another very low year (in terms of ice extent)," Serreze told IPS.

With ever more open water absorbing the sun's heat, the Arctic Ocean is warming up, melting more ice in a positive feedback loop. A day of 24-hour summer sun in the Arctic puts more heat on the surface than a day in the tropics, said Overland. That extra heat in the ocean is gradually released into the lower atmosphere from October to January as the region re-freezes during the 24-hour nights.

Temperatures in January were -2C over the water, while the land was -25C, making conditions far windier and producing more snowfall than normal. Heavy snow on the remaining ice insulates it from the cold air, preventing it from thickening during the long winter.

"Sea ice is the key system in Arctic. It is just like a tropical forest...if the forest is cut down it affects the entire food web," Barber said.

Not only does the loss of ice affect conditions locally but "what happens in the Arctic dictates some of what happens in the mid-latitudes," he added.

This huge mass of warmer air over the Arctic in the late fall not only generates more wind and snow locally, several studies have now documented the impacts on global weather patterns.

The winter of 2005-6 was the coldest in 50 years in Japan and eastern Eurasia, reported Meiji Honda, a senior scientist with the Climate Diagnosis Group at Japan's Agency for Marine-Earth Science and Technology. Honda's studies show that the air over the Arctic was quite warm in the fall of 2005, which altered normal wind patterns, pushing the jet stream further south and bringing arctic cold to much of Eurasia and Japan. He also documented the same mechanism for the colder winters of 2007-8 and 2009-10, he told participants.

In eastern North America, the same conditions of 2007-8 produced increased precipitation and colder temperatures in the winter. As the sea ice declines, big impacts are likely to be seen in this region, said Sara Strey of the University of Illinois.

Another "wild card" in terms of effects from the Arctic warming is how much and how fast the region's permafrost - permanently frozen landscape - that contains enormous amounts of carbon and methane will also melt.

"Things have to change in the Arctic but we don't know what they will all be. That's the scary part," said Serreze.

"Our entire infrastructure is based on the status quo," he said, namely a stable climate of the past 10,000 years. "Change is already here. We must start adapting now. "

http://www.ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=51826
« Last Edit: June 18, 2010, 12:25:34 PM by Lone_woLf »
Change requires you to scream, I'M NOT GONNA TAKE ANY MORE!...and then you don't.

Offline motif

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2010, 01:10:21 PM »
there is NO global warming!
have never seen biggest scam to get out people money yet.
Look into earth history, there are warmer and cooler periods interchangeable and as a matter of fact we're now in cooler period.



I suggest to read some reliable research reports not funded by political parties.

look video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfHW7KR33IQ
« Last Edit: June 18, 2010, 01:20:19 PM by motif »

Offline Woopy

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2010, 03:05:46 PM »
I love when people say things like ''They manipulated the graph''. It's so vague, how about he explain how the graph was manipulated

Offline Lone_woLf

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2010, 05:53:07 PM »
there is NO global warming!


Red Eye? Really? And meteorologists can't even tell you what it's going to be in a week! Maybe you should look up the difference between weather and climate. Weather changes all the time, climate changes gradually.

Wrong. We're not in a cooling period, we're in a warming period. And yes, the climate does fluctuate. This is different. This is caused by us and we don't know what we are doing.

And you're the one with the fire-breathing Al Gore. What was that for exactly? Some kind of lame scare tactic?

More information about the news agency that published this article.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inter_Press_Service

Educate yourself.
http://www.climate.gov/#dataServices
This is put on by NOAA. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. They are a US Government Agency.

« Last Edit: June 18, 2010, 06:00:37 PM by Lone_woLf »
Change requires you to scream, I'M NOT GONNA TAKE ANY MORE!...and then you don't.

Offline Woopy

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2010, 06:29:28 PM »
yeah its definitely not paleo either to burn fuels for cars :P

does oil have a purpose other than to fuel cars?

Offline Lone_woLf

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2010, 06:40:44 PM »
yeah its definitely not paleo either to burn fuels for cars :P

does oil have a purpose other than to fuel cars?

definitely

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum_products
Change requires you to scream, I'M NOT GONNA TAKE ANY MORE!...and then you don't.

Offline Warren Dew

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2010, 08:02:04 PM »
Red Eye? Really? And meteorologists can't even tell you what it's going to be in a week! Maybe you should look up the difference between weather and climate. Weather changes all the time, climate changes gradually.

I concluded global warming was a problem around 1980.  I have to admit, though, that had I had to make a judgement based on current science, it would be a lot less clear.  Back in 1980, the data wasn't being manipulated for reasons of political correctness.

Anyway, in answer to your original question, by 1990 I thought we needed to do something about the problem immediately.  Around 2000, I concluded it was too late.

We're just going to have to learn to live with any climate change that happens.  If the dinosaurs come back, we'll just have to figure out how to eat them.

Offline Woopy

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2010, 09:13:49 PM »
yeah its definitely not paleo either to burn fuels for cars :P

does oil have a purpose other than to fuel cars?

definitely

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum_products

I meant does it serve a purpose in the natural world

Offline Lone_woLf

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2010, 10:20:10 PM »
Fossil fuels were once lifeforms that died, were buried and then for millions of years subjected to heat and pressure. This accumulation removed a sizable amount of carbon and other things from circulation on our planet.
Change requires you to scream, I'M NOT GONNA TAKE ANY MORE!...and then you don't.

Offline Mister Misanthrope

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2010, 10:32:57 PM »
For as unsubstantiated as all claims of global warming really are, I earnestly wish global warming was a reality. The scientists allege that global warming would interrupt the thermal convection currents that fuel the gyres of the major global oceans, which would cause them to fail to properly distribute heat across the planet, resulting in a narrow but extremely hot equatorial band flanked on both sides by endless seas of ice and snow - a winter of apocalyptic proportions, a new ice age.

I earnestly pine for such an ice age for the following reasons:
1. Such an ice age would cleanse the world of all physical and mental defectives, weaklings, uglies and deviants in SHORT order.
2. Such an ice age would restore nature's order to the world, and force us to live in harmony with it or suffer its fury and be cleansed from existence like many failed civilizations before us.
3. My bloodline is 100% Northern European, and the advent of a modern ice age would be the restoration of MY natural habitat, so selfish as it is, I eagerly root for the world to be engulfed by furious winter so I can breed Norse barbarians.

On that note, my mead has gotten the better of me. Good night, cave people!

Destor

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2010, 10:44:05 AM »
What are we worrying about here exactly?  The human race as a whole or the planet itself?

Worrying about either is pretty ridiculous IMO.  The planet has been here for 4.5 billion years and is a self-renewing system.

We should be able to adapt to any changes that might occur whether they are caused by us or by something else.  If we can't, then oh well, guess it's our time to move on.

Tl;dr: caveman do not worry about such things.

Offline Seeled

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2010, 11:09:51 AM »
Tl;dr: caveman do not worry about such things.

And look where it got him. While humans are not significantly evolved to consider the long-term implications of their actions, there is value to such considerations.

In the same way that many humans pursue and enjoy a long and healthy life as individuals, there are many humans who wish to see the species survive in health as a whole.

Caveman is a diverse animal. The broad-thinking worriers and the day-to-day worriers are in mutual debt to each other.

Destor

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2010, 11:35:54 AM »
That was more of a joke comment, but

Wanting society as a whole to thrive and live healthy lives is all well and good, except when we have little understanding of how things work or worse yet when one group of people convinces themselves that they do know how it works...

Being "green" friendy is fantastic, I conserve energy and do other green things but only because it is economically smart in my mind.  The less we use, the more there is for use later on.  It has nothing to do with trying to "save the planet" though.

Then again this is based on my belief that climate change isn't being caused by us, nor will we be able to stop or control it.


Offline Paleo Curmudgeon

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2010, 11:46:38 AM »
To do my part I will try to fart less.

Destor

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Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2010, 12:19:45 PM »
Thad the way to do it, save some farts for future generations

CAVEMANforum - The most popular Paleo diet and caveman exercise discussion site

Re: Global Warming/Climate Change: Are we beyond the point of no return?
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2010, 12:19:45 PM »