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Messages - Warren Dew

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4456
Research / Re: NY Times: Carnivorism vs Environmentalism
« on: December 29, 2009, 08:06:05 PM »
I do think we need to develop alternative energies, as much as possible.

Conservation is good, too.  I spent a lot of money on the latest triple pane insulated windows ten years ago, and I think I've gotten all that money back in savings on heating bills, while burning only half as much fossil fuels.  This year I got the walls fully insulated, which should cut my heating bills in half again, and I'm gradually changing over to LED light bulbs, which while expensive only use 10% as much electricity.

4457
Miscellaneous / Re: migraines
« on: December 29, 2009, 07:56:55 PM »
If you are talking about the painful asymmetric kind of migraine - the kind that feels like a railroad spike is being driven through your temple - my wife and I used to get them regularly.  Since going paleo, neither of us has had any, though we've had a few regular headaches instead.  A regular headache feels like a migraine, but with a nerf ball instead of a railroad spike.

4458
Diet and nutrition / Re: oatmeal for breakfast? (noob alert!)
« on: December 29, 2009, 02:17:42 PM »
So eggs are cool? Are eggs considered non-dairy, because I know dairy is supposed to be de-emphasized in a paleo diet? I love eggs, and they really satiate me, especially for breakfast after which I usually am not hungry at all then all morning, no snacks needed.

Eggs are fine.  The reason dairy is nonpaleo is because people didn't have livestock to milk until they started adopting a pastoral lifestyle, some time during the mesolithic.  Eggs were around to be gathered for millions of years before that.

The satiety advantage will give you a hint at how the paleo diet works.  If you get your calories from animal fat and a little protein, you aren't hungry all the time, so you don't need to overeat.

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I like omelettes too, but I think cheese just goes to my lard arse, so I better than sprinkle a tiny bit of feta into an omelette loaded with spinach and mushrooms?

Skipping the feta completely would be best.  You could dice some left over meat from dinner and include that in the omelet.

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[EDIT]: Let me ask this-- why exactly is it wrong to eat some grain / cereal with the Paleo Diet? I understand in principle it is not pure Paleo Diet (although I just found an article (dated 12/19/2009) in the news about the discover of Paleo people eating grains, even storing them in their caves, etc.,
http://heritage-key.com/blogs/owenjarus/eat-your-breakfast-archaeologist-finds-cave-full-stone-age-cereal
so technically grains just might be considered part of Paleo peoples' diets.  But I guess what I am trying to get at is what harm does eating some grain, some yogurt, into a diet that is mostly strict Paleo; what will be the consequence of so doing, and why? Is is a matter of degrees-- that doing so would simply mean a slightly lesser benefit of Paleo Diet benefits, or does so doing completely sabotage the Paleo diet benefits?

The problem with grains and cereal are that our bodies aren't adapted to eating them.  Eggs, as you note, make you less hungry after you eat them, because our bodies have evolved to eat only as much animal fat and protein as needed to maintain our optimal weight.  In contrast, grains end up making us more hungry, because they mess with our homeostasis "switches" in ways we weren't designed to handle.  The result is that grains make us overeat and cause us to get fat.

Again, see the Taubes video I mentioned in the previous post for the details.

With regard to that recent finding, the date generally reported in the popular press is at the high end of the range - and even then it's an order of magnitude below the millions of years of the paleolithic.  It's also unclear whether the grain were used as foods, or even purposely used at all.  See a previous thread on that topic here:

http://cavemanforum.com/index.php?topic=2227.0

4459
Diet and nutrition / Re: oatmeal for breakfast? (noob alert!)
« on: December 29, 2009, 02:00:11 PM »
Hello!

(noob alert  ;D) Is occasional (1-2x/week) oatmeal for breakfast okay?

Oatmeal would be considered a cheat, as it's not paleo.  Now, many of us do cheat from time to time - the most common cheats are coffee or small amounts of high cocoa chocolate, I think - but oatmeal, because of its concentrated starch, is the kind of cheat that may make it very difficult to stay on the diet.  The reason for this is because starch digests to pure glucose, which is highly insulinogenic and thus tends to result in hunger and carb cravings.  More on this later.

I see that marika provides some alternatives for breakfast that may work for you, but I still mention it because starchy grains seem to be in a lot of places in your diet, along with other nonpaleo foods.  You may not realize how prevalent these are on a standard American diet, so I've bolded them below:

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Breakfasts for me are typically poached eggs on one piece of 40 cal bread, or grapefruit, or an omelet, or nothing, or french toast made withe the 40 cals per slice bread and low-no-cal syrup, or eggs and ham. This morning I had 1/4 cup (dry) oatmeal, 1/4 tsp powdered milk, 1/4 tsp honey (all nuked for a minute).

Currently my goal is to lose 50 pounds over six months. Started two weeks ago, down 10 lbs doing basic paleo diet, but from reading some posts here I might be snacking on too much fruit, and I also like snacking on cottage cheese, and low-cal (70 cals, Activa brand) yogurt. 288lbs, BMR ~2800, exercising 200-400 cals a day (walking, indoor exercycle, wii fitness), maintaining a negative calorie balance of -1500 cals or so each day. Diet of steak, fish, shrimp, crab, eggs, salads, lots of veggies, oranges and apples, low-cal yogurt, cottage cheese, sprout hummus tomato sandwiches made with low-cal (40 per slice) bread.

The bolded items are the items you'll need to eliminate if you want to go paleo.  As you can see, nonpaleo foods are a lot more prevalent in our diet than one might think at first glance!  The paleolithic diet is quite a large lifestyle change.

Now, there is a plus side.  If you actually adopt a good paleo diet without cheating, you can forget about counting calories.  You can eat as much as you want of the allowed foods, as long as you avoid the forbidden ones.  You'll lose weight until you reach your optimum weight anyway.

In fact, it would be a good idea to drop the whole "calories in calories out" energy balance idea.  Diets based on energy balance tend not to work for most people, because you're fighting the body's natural homeostasis.  The idea behind the paleo diet is to work with your body instead of against it.  More on that later, too.

Finally, I would say not to worry too much about fruit just yet.  You have to get your calories somewhere, and without the neolithic grains, legumes, and dairy, you have basically two choices:  fruit and fat - and the the fat will normally be animal fat, since vegetable oils are not paleo.  You see a lot on these forums about getting rid of the fruit in favor of healthy animal fats, but that's for people who are trying to lose the last five pounds.  For the first 50 pounds, replacing the neolithic calories with fruit will also work, and will give you some time to get used to the idea of fatty meat being healthy.

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New here. I will scour the posts for info. Read several books this past week on Paleo diet. It makes perfect sense to me because I teach biology (anatomy, physiology) including evolution. I also have a medical background, though in spite of that am a victim of modern society's food and the agricultural revolution that began 10,000 years ago to ruin our bodies.

I said I would give you more about the problems with starch carbohydrate and about working with the body's homeostasis rather than fighting it with a diet based on energy balance.  Specifically, I strongly recommend watching the video linked to in this thread:

http://cavemanforum.com/index.php?topic=1446.msg12124#msg12124

It's a little long, but with your background in biology and medicine, I think you'll find it very interesting.  Watch the first 10-15 minutes of the talk, and I think you'll want to see the rest of it too.  It does go against the currently accepted medical wisdom, but as you can see, the speaker is being asked to speak at respected medical establishments, so it is worth listening to - and I say that as someone who normally hates videos and prefers written material.

4460
Introductions / Re: Greetings all. How do I break my aversion to fish?
« on: December 29, 2009, 01:09:48 PM »
Welcome!

I've been reading up on the paleo diet, and also the Japanese diet, for a few weeks now and I'm thinking I might want to make a switch. Even if I don't remove all the grains, I could at least remove the fatty meats, and eat more vegetables.

You don't have to get rid of the fatty meat - fatty meat was as much a part of the paleolithic diet as fish.  Getting rid of the grains, legumes, and dairy is the key.

As for fish, you can start with some of the more robust fish, like tuna and salmon, as you say.  You can get fresh or frozen tuna and salmon steaks that cook pretty much the same way as beef steaks cook, though it's done a bit faster.

Beef and pork are fine, too, though, as far as the paleo diet goes.  If you want to be particularly strict, you can go for the grass fed beef.

4461
Link to another thread discussing this:

http://cavemanforum.com/index.php?topic=2227.0

4462
Exercises / Re: How much exercise to lose weight?
« on: December 29, 2009, 11:09:17 AM »
But I notice when I exercise I also eat more cals for the day.

This is exactly why exercise is generally not the best primary tool for weight loss.  Exercise can make you healthier, but it won't by itself do much for weight loss, absent a starvation diet that's difficult to sustain.

Is there any reason why you locked your thread in the diet forum?  Based on your post there, there are some dietary changes you could make that could help a lot.

4463
Introductions / Re: Far from Famished...400 pounds to 250 pounds
« on: December 29, 2009, 10:58:21 AM »
Seems like you have a reasonable start.

I would give up the half and half and maybe the cream as well as the cheese and butter.  Dairy is nonpaleo just as grains and legumes are.  Half and half also has some carbs in it, if you're really trying to keep your carbs down.

4464
Food Journals / Cautionary tales #4
« on: December 29, 2009, 10:29:44 AM »
Now for Christmas, I'm having a lot of sweets again, and this time it's not all paleo due in part to a box of Godiva chocolates received as a gift.  I'm taking the precautionary vitamin C again.  We'll see if the vitamin C is enough to compensate for the modern industrial age sugars.

This was pretty much the same amount of sugar as for vigil - the equivalent of most of a pecan pie filling, partly paleo and partly not, plus most of a box of chocolates, over the course of Dec 25, 26, and 27.  The vitamin C seems to have worked again - 1500mg over three days.  I did have a bit of a scare one night when it seemed like I was starting to have a sore throat, but I was fine by morning.

I think I conclude that large amounts of supplemental vitamin C helps make up for even nonpaleo sweets from the standpoint of the immune system.  The only thing that remains to be tested is whether paleo honey based sweets could be handled without vitamin C.

However, there were other bad effects.  Before I first started paleo, I was starting to get farsighted - my near vision was getting worse.  This partially reversed on the paleo diet.  I noticed that the binging on sugar last week started making my near vision noticeably worse again.  That happened early enough in the week that I think just the large amounts of honey would do it.

A day of very low carb yesterday seems to have fixed that, but I don't think I want to risk substantial amounts of honey in my diet on any regular basis.  48 years of nonpaleo eating have put me too close to the edge on issues related to protein crosslinking like that.

Edit:  My daughter had a cold throughout this period.  I quit taking the vitamin C when there were only a few chocolates left, and ate those few chocolates over the next couple of days.  During that time, I caught my daughter's cold.  So, maybe vitamin C works for nonpaleo sweets, but you really have to keep taking the vitamin C over the entire period of eating the sweets!

4465
Food Journals / Re: Sassy Sarah's Super Sexy Slimdown
« on: December 29, 2009, 08:37:58 AM »
1 cup lady grey tea w/1 tsp sugar (not paleo....but WAY less sugar that before).  It's a gradual process eh?!
One additional step that may be easy to make would be to use honey instead of sugar.

Also Chinese teas seem to need sugar less.

4466
Diet and nutrition / Re: Affordability factor.
« on: December 29, 2009, 07:54:10 AM »
Im here to learn so where can I improve?

The problem is that when you post one day of food, it's usually not fully representative of what you normally eat.  So, you could try keeping a food journal.  Make sure you post everything you eat, even if it's a cheat or breaks the diet, and do it every day.

Once you've kept a journal for a couple of weeks, it's much easier to identify what you need to do to improve.


4467
Recipes and meal photos / Re: Help with chciken gizzards and hearts please.
« on: December 27, 2009, 07:11:57 PM »
I fried some gizzards once without boiling them first, and they were pretty tough.  This may be a case where your mother is right.

4468
Diet and nutrition / Re: Dairy
« on: December 27, 2009, 01:27:03 PM »
Goat's milk is definitely still dairy, though it's probably less likely to be from corn fed animals.

I think dairy started with large groups of people claiming ownership over herds of migrating ungulates - as for example happened in historical times with reindeer.  Then they probably stopped the migrations so they could take more control - or controlled nonmigratory sheep and such - and once they had clear ownership of some herds, they then had the opportunity to harvest the milk, instead of waiting for it to be turned into calves.

Edit:  come to think of it, slaughtering still nursing calves or kids to eat might have caused people to think the milk they had been drinking would go to waste if the mothers weren't milked.

4469
My paleo cooking generally involves a lot of knives and high heat.  Those may not be the best recipes for kids.

In fact, I have a hard time thinking of paleo recipes that would be safe for younger kids to work on.  Soups maybe?

4470
Food Journals / Re: Cautionary tales
« on: December 25, 2009, 09:04:10 PM »
Just to provide more data on the sugar and vitamin C thing:

This past monday night, Dec 21-22, we held solstice vigil, which involved a fair amount of eating.  Over the two days, I ate about a whole pecan pie's worth of filling, albeit from honey instead of sugar.  That amounted to about 400g of sugar, albeit from a paleo source (honey).  I also took one vitamin C pill each of the two days as a precaution - 1000mg of vitamin C total.

I did not get sick.  I don't know whether that was because honey is better than sugar, or because of the vitamin C.  I don't plan to make that a regular habit - vitamin C pills are obviously not paleo - but around the holidays it's hard to avoid some sweets.  I did gain a couple of pounds.

Now for Christmas, I'm having a lot of sweets again, and this time it's not all paleo due in part to a box of Godiva chocolates received as a gift.  I'm taking the precautionary vitamin C again.  We'll see if the vitamin C is enough to compensate for the modern industrial age sugars.

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