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Messages - Warren Dew

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4456
Progress Reports & Photos / Re: exercisegate
« on: January 29, 2010, 08:17:32 AM »
I was jsut htinking, is there a term for someone who is obese and healthy?  I mean acutally healthy, exercises, has lean muscle mass, eats right...but just happens to not lose the weight.  Of course this would be just about unheard of in our group, but in teh general population it is possible.

The term is "bodybuilder" or "weightlifter", I think.  The only way one can exercise and eat right - that is, paleo - and still maintain a BMI over 30 in the long term is for that weight to be mostly muscle.

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I am still technically 'overweight', until I started eating primal (yes I admit it I am niot a strict paleo...don't hold it against me please!) I could NOT lose weight.  I ate 'healthy', I exercised; weight lifting, HIIT, and cardio (this is forced upon me until further notice and has been since Dec 2006).  All of my indicators for health are good, they have been good.  Good lipid profiles, low blood pressure, low resting HR (it used to be high-average), etc.  So although I was obese I was genuinely healthy.  Albiet, I am in MUCH better health now :-)

So is there a 'term' for that?

No offense, but I think the term is "self deluded".  Eating 'healthy' is not actually eating healthy; the food pyramid is actually quite unhealthy.  At best one might be fit but unhealthy in other respects.

It's possible to maintain fitness - a high aerobic rate and whatever muscles one uses - with exercise while on a sucky diet; I know because I've done that.  That's not everything there is to health, though.  It's better to have an actual healthy diet that allows the exercise to build more capability rather than just having to exercise hard to maintain what you have.

If you're in much better health now, that's probably an indication that you weren't really fully healthy before.

4457
Diet and nutrition / Re: Farmed salmon v Wild Salmon
« on: January 29, 2010, 07:50:30 AM »
Apparently farmed salmon presently has as much omega 3 as wild salmon, but more omega 6.  Farmed salmon is fattier which partially compensates for a lower omega 3:6 ratio.

However, it sounds like the salmon farms are moving away from feed based on fish meal and fish oil, and toward feed with more grains and vegetable oil, which will further limit the omega 3s in farmed salmon.

http://www.doh.wa.gov/ehp/oehas/fish/farmedsalmon.htm

4458
Progress Reports & Photos / Re: exercise and weightloss
« on: January 28, 2010, 05:21:41 PM »
Take the stairs 2 at a time. Then work on going faster. Once that is easy go for 3 at a time, then faster. Then start exploding up using the handrail to add some upper body work. Switch sides at each staircase. Go for 4 stairs at a time. Really focus on recruiting more motor units. Just get your heart pounding!  This is something I did in high school to develop more explosiveness in my kicks and knee strikes. It worked well! ;D
That's a good idea.  I'll do that.

4459
Progress Reports & Photos / Re: whoo hoo
« on: January 28, 2010, 05:16:51 PM »
Try different kinds of vegetables.  Green vegetables are good, but so are sauteed onions and mushrooms, and squash, etc.

4460
Diet and nutrition / Re: Short on cash: Rice?
« on: January 28, 2010, 11:56:34 AM »
Dr. Harris over at the PaNu blog says that sweet potatoes and white rice should be ok in moderation.

That just illustrates that PaNu is definitely not paleo.

I would rather go for tubers and plantains instead of rice. They are also cheap where I live, taro, sweet potato, cassava, plantains, etc.

Likewise not paleo.

Starchy foods aren't likely to do any good, anyway.  You're still going to need just as much protein, and fat is generally free anyway.  The only reason there would be any utility to starchy calories beyond that is if you climb mountains for a living or something like that.

4461
Diet and nutrition / Re: GOMAD?
« on: January 28, 2010, 11:50:15 AM »
Meat would probably work better.

4462
Miscellaneous / Re: Bit of support needed
« on: January 28, 2010, 09:22:04 AM »
I hug and squeeze my daughter, but that may only work with a small child.

I think the hobby suggestion is a good one.  Whatever you enjoy spending your free time on the rest of the year, half an hour or an hour of it might work.

4463
Diet and nutrition / Re: Farmed salmon v Wild Salmon
« on: January 28, 2010, 07:38:14 AM »
I think it depends on how you feel about mercury, as farmed salmon tends to be farmed along polluted coasts.  I'd probably risk it once every couple weeks if I had to.

4464
Progress Reports & Photos / Re: exercise and weightloss
« on: January 28, 2010, 07:34:58 AM »
Enter the 8-minute workout http://www.tabataprotocol.com.

It's still exercise for exercise's sake rather than something I can do in the normal course of my day, and thus spare time I don't have.

To clarify, I don't work close enough to walk to my workplace, other than the couple of blocks from my parking structure.  What I do do is walk up the stairs instead of taking the elevator.  If I could get an office on a 20th floor instead of the 5th floor, I guess that would basically become a daily Tabata.

4465
Introductions / Re: Nice cave! Mind if I join you??
« on: January 27, 2010, 11:53:05 PM »
Thanks for the response to my question, Corey.  Now I can recommend fatty meats without any doubts.

4466
Diet and nutrition / Re: favorite fats?
« on: January 27, 2010, 11:49:23 PM »
My favorite is unhydrogenated leaf lard.  It's low in saturated fats, though that probably doesn't matter, and reasonably high in omega 3s.  Unfortunately I can't currently find it.

I currently use grass fed tallow for most of my cooking.  It makes foods quite delicious, probably due to the good omega 3:6 balance.

I do still use organic butter for a few things, even though it isn't paleo.  I have coconut oil around, though I only occasionally use it, and only in small amounts.

Edit:  oh, and I use bacon grease that's left in the pan after frying uncured bacon.

4467
Diet and nutrition / Re: Short on cash: Rice?
« on: January 27, 2010, 11:41:54 PM »
7) Fatty ground beef: 80% is usually cheaper than 90%.

Plus the 80% ground beef will be twice as satisfying as the 90%.  I usually look for 70% ground beef; if you don't insist on grass fed, it's cheaper per calorie than bread, and probably cheaper than rice once you figure in the carb cravings the rice will trigger.

Pork is also cheaper than beef.

Here's a Wegman's flyer that shows sirloin steaks at $2.99 per pound and roasting chickens at $0.79 per pound.  I'm thinking that if you check the current flyer you'll be able to find some inexpensive meat of some sort on any given week.

http://flyer.wegmans.com/wgm/Default.aspx?z=BF&s=Alberta%20Drive&n=82&ad=24thjan2010hfnvjb7euik&d=1/24/2010

4468
Progress Reports & Photos / Re: exercise and weightloss
« on: January 27, 2010, 11:28:26 PM »
First off, thanks for splitting this thread!

If you do not use muscle it disappears, and it hangs onto the fat as an energy store. It is as simple as that. What do you think replaces it?

I don't think it's that simple.  What you say is indeed what happens when someone goes on a starvation version of the standard American diet.  But that's because the standard American diet has barely enough animal protein to start with; cut it in half, and of course the dieter will lose muscle.  Meanwhile, there's still plenty of carbohydrate to cause insulin spikes which drive the calories into fat rather than allowing them to be burned as fuel.

On a paleo diet things are quite different, though.  There's plenty of animal protein to maintain muscle.  Carbohydrates are more limited and generally less insulinogenic, so lower and more stable insulin levels allow the stored fat to be burned as fuel.

While I do agree with wlfdg that fear of injury shouldn't prevent one from getting exercise, I do also think there may be some merit to marika's idea that obese people who are losing weight are essentially people who are recovering from a prolonged illness, and should take appropriate care in doing that.

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Moreover I just posted an article above which more than suggests that sedentary behaviour in itself is a huge health concern. But I guess it is easier to just ignore it.

I don't know if it was there when you linked it, but your second link has a huge disclaimer that the study in question didn't prove anything; a correlation is not a causation.  And again, statistics that apply to people on a deficient standard diet don't say much about people on a healthy paleo diet.

I don't think Wlfdg wanted us all to climb mountains twice a day like he does, just that a lifestyle without exercise was absolutely not healthy. I agree.

I see it a little differently.

I'd be more than happy to climb mountains all day if there were any mountains on my doorstep and if climbing mountains and snowboarding were my way of life.  I was even willing to jump on an exercise bike and dial my heart rate up to 180 bpm when it helped me in competition.  However, I'm not willing to waste a lot of time driving to a gym full of specialized machines for artificial exercise that has nothing to do with my present lifestyle.

If I could find a way to get more exercise as a natural part of my life, I would.  As it is, though, what fits in is walking up to my office instead of taking the elevator and carrying a toddler around all the time.  I'm open to suggestions that don't involve artificially setting aside spare time that I don't have.

4469
Progress Reports & Photos / Re: exercisegate
« on: January 27, 2010, 11:02:44 PM »
That's a little harsh.  She did do a lot of research and dredged up some interesting info.

Not to mention her very interesting foray into meat only, from which I think we learned a lot.

Well, this has saddened me very much.  :(  I am going to bow out so that Wlfdg can come back.

I don't think you need to do that.  I'm sure Wlfdg is quite capable of making his own decisions without needing other people to make way for him.

4470
Introductions / Re: ...uh...hello
« on: January 27, 2010, 06:16:16 PM »
Welcome!

It sounds like you're off to a great start - except for the pretzel sticks, of course.  Good job tossing the croutons.


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