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Messages - Warren Dew

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4456
Diet and nutrition / Re: The study of meat only diets
« on: December 15, 2009, 04:03:02 PM »
I've also had some bad experiences from cheats when on a mostly meat diet.  Despite the low vitamin C, I don't seem to get sick as long as I don't cheat, but the immunosuppressive effects of refined sugar and other concentrated carbohydrates seem to be exacerbated on a diet devoid of inflammatory agents like grains.

Eventually I'm hoping I'll learn not to cheat; until then, I use vitamin C pills if I realize I've had too much carbohydrate.

4457
Introductions / Re: Hi!!!
« on: December 15, 2009, 01:29:45 PM »
Welcome!

If you're feeling very hungry on the paleo diet, you're probably following a version of the diet that's not quite right.  The most likely thing is that you're eating excessively lean meat and not getting enough fat.

Go ahead and eat fatty cuts of meat.

4458
Diet and nutrition / Re: Why is salt bad?
« on: December 15, 2009, 01:12:13 PM »
Two reasons I can think of off the top of my head:

1.  Table salt is exclusively sodium chloride, so excessive amounts of it tend to mess up one's electrolyte balance, specifically the sodium/potassium ratio.

2.  Many of us on the paleo diet find that excessive salt gives us the runs.

Very small amounts of salt are needed by the body; it's excessive amounts that are bad.

4459
Introductions / Re: Howdy...I'm starting today...
« on: December 15, 2009, 07:15:52 AM »
Welcome!

Tips:  too much salt is bad, yes, but fat can be good, especially those with good omega 3:6 ratios.  If you are trying to lose weight, starchy carbohydrates are the primary enemy, not fat.

For some reason I thought pork would be bad for me...at least bacon

Cured bacon with a lot of nitrates and salt can be bad, but it's because of the nitrates and salt, not the pork itself.  Uncured low salt bacon is fine.

4460
Miscellaneous / Re: Blood type
« on: December 14, 2009, 10:37:18 PM »
I'm A positive.  My wife is A negative.

4461
Diet and nutrition / Re: Low carb, no carb, what's the scoop?
« on: December 14, 2009, 12:40:35 PM »
I think in general dietary parlance, "low carb" is any diet that has fewer calories from carbohydrates than from fat.  By that definition, probably just about everyone on this forum eats "low carb".

A lot of people on this forum are closer to "very low carb", maybe in the range of 10% of calories from carbohydrates.

4462
Miscellaneous / Re: Depression
« on: December 13, 2009, 07:12:48 PM »
I keep reading about how happy and good you guys are feeling, that's great! I'm just wondering how you deal with being around all the other carb-eaters in your life? Are you able to be just as sociable as you were before? Do you allow yourself to have a glass of wine at parties? How do you manage to be so extremely different with your diet, while remaining a member of a food-focused/carb-focused world? I live in North Carolina, and that's all people do around here... eat, party, and eat some more... everyone in the Carolinas is pretty much overweight. It's madness!  :D

Well, I'm married and have kids, so I mostly socialize with my family; that makes it not a problem for me.

That said, I've always been a teetotaler, so I've always avoided alcohol based entertainment.  When I have lunch with coworkers, I just order something with meat and don't eat the nonpaleo parts of the meal.


4463
I ended up buying Gedgaudes's book.  I've read maybe a quarter to a third of it, but I do have some comments.

I don't disagree with the general thrust of her book, but I do notice that she has a strong tendency to oversimplify and to state things in a much more positive way than is justified.  Where Taubes will take you all the way through voluminous amounts of research and let you decide for yourself, Gedgaudes will just present the conclusions - and they'll be her conclusions, not necessarily the researchers' conclusions.

Her discussion of the mToR pathway is a good example.  She says the mToR pathway is the "protein switch" the way insulin is the "carbohydrate switch".  As it turns out, though, that's quite misleading; if you look at the actual research, mToR reacts to all caloric intake, and the protein sensitivity doesn't appear to be much higher than the carbohydrate sensitivity.

In addition, some parts of the book read more like a list of notes than like an organized book.  For me, this makes it hard to read - but without the benefit from Taubes's book of getting more information.

4464
Research / Re: I saw this in the news and it's scaring me.
« on: December 12, 2009, 02:50:06 PM »
Here's a link to a thread containing a very useful video on this subject, if you have the time.

http://cavemanforum.com/index.php?topic=1446.0

4465
Introductions / Re: a Cavewoman in search of health and fitness
« on: December 12, 2009, 10:46:15 AM »
ketosis, as far as i know, is when there are elevated levels of ketone bodies in your body. they occure when fat is burned (fat you eat with your diet or fat from your body. so this occurs in a low carb diet, fat loss diet or fast.)

fat is directly converted to ATP but ketogens are a byproduct.

your brain can only use glucose as fuel, the liver can do this job for you and turn protein into glucose.
so the body is able to function on fat/protein only.

correct me who knows better but thats what i can remember from everything i read about it.

That's pretty much my understanding too.

I think the ketosis headaches happen when the liver first "learns" to do gluconeogenesis - turning protein into glucose.  There can be a few days when there isn't enough glucose for the brain.  Once you're into long term ketosis, that's no longer an issue.

4466
Miscellaneous / Re: Depression
« on: December 12, 2009, 09:56:06 AM »
Sunlight, listening to your circadian rhythms and exercise. This will help.

I agree with those too.

Quote
One thing though that I think a lot of people need to know about anti-depressants, is that new research has shown that they do not in fact alter brain chemistry as once thought, but actually heal neurons.

http://xmb.stuffucanuse.com/xmb/viewthread.php?tid=5376

Interesting link.  However, it looks to me like that link says that SSRI (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor) antidepressants like Prozac do still alter brain chemistry - just that they may also heal neurons, and the latter is the important effect.

I'm not sure about the characterization of which is the important effect.  That page - although perhaps not the studies - appears to mischaracterize "Prozac lag".  I had a live in girlfriend for five years who, it eventually turned out, was bipolar (as was her father), but was diagnosed with regular depression and put on Prozac.  She was told by her psychiatrist that there was a "Prozac lag" that came from the fact that the drug took a couple weeks to reach equilibrium levels in the body.

However, I could always tell if she had taken her Prozac on a daily basis.  Whenever I noticed particular irritability, I'd ask if she had taken her Prozac that morning, and she'd get really angry at me for reminding her, but she never had.  Then for a while I'd sometimes ask when it wasn't a bad day, just to check that it wasn't that she never took it, and on those days, she wouldn't get angry about the question and she would always have taken it.  I was only wrong once or twice over several years.

Based on that, I think "Prozac lag" is something of a myth.  There might well be a healing effect as well, but I think the immediate biochemical effect is real and is definitely important.

I note that omega 3 fats, or rather a proper omega 3:6 ratio, may operate similarly.  The well known effect is that omega 3 and omega 6 fats are two main components of the myelin sheath that insulates the nerve cells, in roughly equal amounts.  They also seem to affect brain signaling and serotonin levels, though those effects are less clear.  I think that backs up your point that dietary interventions should be tried before SSRIs.

4467
Diet and nutrition / Re: Cooking methods
« on: December 11, 2009, 08:37:06 PM »
Oops, I forgot that I do make roasts in the oven.

4468
Miscellaneous / Re: Depression
« on: December 11, 2009, 08:35:50 PM »
JWSthe3rd, I've never been clinically depressed, but my wife was for a while.  She came out of it when she went on paleo, but she also had a baby at the same time, so we can't be sure it was paleo that did it.

I would say, though, that depression is one of the things that will be helped only by specific paleo foods.  Specifically, insufficient omega 3 fats have been linked to postnatal depression and anecdotally to general depression and bipolar.  If for you paleo makes you initially depressive, you probably need to make sure that the paleo foods you eat have healthy amounts of omega 3s.

Basically, that means ditching the vegetable oils and sticking to animal fats.  Your eggs need to be omega 3 eggs or free range eggs.  Eating grass fed beef in preference to grain fed beef might be a significant benefit.  It might be better to prepare the eggs in a way that leaves the yolks liquid.

Wlfdg, you were bipolar?  I can hardly imagine anyone more stable now.


4469
Introductions / Re: a Cavewoman in search of health and fitness
« on: December 11, 2009, 03:31:48 PM »
Welcome!

i understand that my 85% chocolate is not really "paleo" but i eat 1-3 pieces a day and belive its the best antidepressant existing. so iam not giving that up!

I won't criticize the chocolate, as I cheat with small amounts too, but I will note that a proper omega 3:6 balance seems to help a lot with preventing depression.  In your case, free range organic meat and eggs might be the best sources of that, and the eggs may be less expensive than the meat.

On lard, I'd also caution to check whether it's hydrogenated.  In the U.S. what one finds in the grocery store is usually hydrogenated, which means it has harmful trans fats and should be avoided.

4470
Diet and nutrition / Re: Borderline case!
« on: December 11, 2009, 03:23:22 PM »
Potatoes have less intense/different toxins, but you may be more susceptible to them.
I am pretty sure that what made the difference for me was that potato starch itself is less digestible than wheat starch.  That meant I developed undesirable intestinal flora from starch I didn't digest, leading to constant painful gas.

I do agree that the proteins in wheat seem to make it a bigger long term concern, especially if it's whole or high gluten wheat, but for me, the painful acute symptoms of potatoes would make me avoid them as well under almost any conditions.

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