Author Topic: Cholesterol Readings for HGs  (Read 1021 times)

Offline ajmesa

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Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« on: April 07, 2010, 09:44:06 PM »
I have noticed that the cholesterol readings of HGs are not high, even for those that consume a really high amount of saturated fat. Here are some examples:

  • Tokelau islanders consume a diet really high in saturated fats (40-50% of their calories), mostly from coconut. Other staples are fish, breadfruit, and some tubers (by the time the measurements were done these starchy plants were part of the diet). Their total cholesterol was 182 mg/dL, LDL 119 mg/dL, triglycerides 80 mg/dL. All data from "Migration and Health in a Small Society: the Case of Tokelau."
  • Masai people have "low" total cholesterol according to this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14193818?ordinalpos=84&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum. I cannot get a number, but it definitely is less than 200 mg/dL. I remember reading a number around 140 mg/dL once.
  • Please tell me if you have data on other groups. Maybe I just found data on the exceptions instead of the norm.

Despite having good cholesterol ratios (low risks of CHD), why is it that a lot of paleo eaters have high total cholesterol? The groups I mentioned have a diet abundant in saturated fat (>30%) yet their numbers are lower than a lot of paleo eaters that claim their high total cholesterol is due to the amount of saturated fat in their diet. Why is there a difference between the HGs and paleo eaters?

** Just to clarify, I am not claiming paleo eaters have "bad" cholesterol readings, all of us have high HDL, low triglycerides, and mostly "fluffy" LDL. :)
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Offline Paleo Curmudgeon

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2010, 08:28:50 AM »
There are different types of saturated fat. Some types raise cholesterol and some are neutral. The HG also don't buy feed lot meat and get plenty of exercise.  They don't drive their SUV 2 miles to the gym to exercise on a treadmill.

Offline ajmesa

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2010, 09:39:36 AM »
There are different types of saturated fat. Some types raise cholesterol and some are neutral. The HG also don't buy feed lot meat and get plenty of exercise.  They don't drive their SUV 2 miles to the gym to exercise on a treadmill.
I think that's a poor reflection of the paleo community. We try to eat the same saturated fat that HGs eat, we don't buy feed lot meat (or at least try not to), and most also get plenty of exercise (no treadmill needed). This doesn't explain it.
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Offline Paleo Curmudgeon

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2010, 12:42:01 PM »
No matter how hard we in modern society try to emulate HG society it is nearly impossible.  Maybe we don't drive our SUVs to the gym, but most of us don't live close enough to work that we walk to work. When we do get to work, sitting while driving, we are stuck in a cubicle 8 to 10 hours a day, only to have a commute back home.

You original post said: "saturated fats (40-50% of their calories), mostly from coconut..  Coconut oil is a type of medium chain saturated fatty acid that is quickly used by the body as energy. But, that may only apply if you are using the energy in tasks, such as hunting or gathering. If they were sitting on the couch watching TV the coconut oil may have a different effect.  Also, although the Tokelau islanders are claimed to be 'healthy' their average life expectancy is 63 years. That's about 19 years less than Australia and 15 years less than the USA.

Offline ajmesa

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2010, 02:46:58 PM »
No matter how hard we in modern society try to emulate HG society it is nearly impossible.  Maybe we don't drive our SUVs to the gym, but most of us don't live close enough to work that we walk to work. When we do get to work, sitting while driving, we are stuck in a cubicle 8 to 10 hours a day, only to have a commute back home.
This doesn't explain why there is a difference in cholesterol readings, which is what I am asking.


You original post said: "saturated fats (40-50% of their calories), mostly from coconut..  Coconut oil is a type of medium chain saturated fatty acid that is quickly used by the body as energy. But, that may only apply if you are using the energy in tasks, such as hunting or gathering. If they were sitting on the couch watching TV the coconut oil may have a different effect. 
What about the Masai?

Also, although the Tokelau islanders are claimed to be 'healthy' their average life expectancy is 63 years. That's about 19 years less than Australia and 15 years less than the USA.
You do know all HGs have a much lower life expectancy than western countries right? They don't die from Symdrom X diseases though. BTW, that number cannot be for the HGs, most HGs have a life expectancy of around 30-40 years.
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Offline Warren Dew

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2010, 06:20:38 PM »
Despite having good cholesterol ratios (low risks of CHD), why is it that a lot of paleo eaters have high total cholesterol?

Paleo Dude is correct.  It's because we sit around all day instead of standing up and walking around all day.

It's also because, on average, paleo dieters are older.

Offline ajmesa

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2010, 06:55:23 PM »
Despite having good cholesterol ratios (low risks of CHD), why is it that a lot of paleo eaters have high total cholesterol?

Paleo Dude is correct.  It's because we sit around all day instead of standing up and walking around all day.

It's also because, on average, paleo dieters are older.

Hmm.... OK. I am not aware of studies that relate physical activity with cholesterol levels, care to provide?

I think the age part might play a bigger role, I didn't think about that initially. At the same time, cholesterol doesn't seem to be correlated with age in traditional societies (i.e. Kitava).
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Offline Warren Dew

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2010, 08:21:53 PM »
Hmm.... OK. I am not aware of studies that relate physical activity with cholesterol levels, care to provide?

Unfortunately it's hard to study overall activity level - not a lot of westerners have a really active lifestyle - but here's one that shows a decrease in cholesterol even just with some exercise for people who are at constant weight:

http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/254/7/919

Quote
I think the age part might play a bigger role, I didn't think about that initially. At the same time, cholesterol doesn't seem to be correlated with age in traditional societies (i.e. Kitava).

Do we have enough data to really say it doesn't change with age in traditional societies?

Although I'd certainly agree that aging on a high calorie, high carb western diet - which is what a lot of us older paleo dieters had before we went paleo - is probably worse than aging on a hunter gatherer diet, or even a Kitavan diet.

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Re: Cholesterol Readings for HGs
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2010, 08:21:53 PM »