Author Topic: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight  (Read 1193 times)

Offline ajmesa

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High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« on: March 11, 2010, 07:09:23 PM »
Most of the articles I have read related to clinical trials with diets high in saturated fatty acids (SFA) are done with obese patients. As we know, the results are amazing.

I am interested in knowing how a diet high in SFA performs on subjects that have a stable weight (i.e., are not gaining or losing weight). I have only been able to find one research paper, please post any other you know:

http://www.adajournal.org/article/S0002-8223(08)02336-5/abstract

Comparative Effects of Three Popular Diets on Lipids, Endothelial Function, and C-Reactive Protein during Weight Maintenance

Forget about the total cholesterol. People on the other diets (not atkins) had lower small particle (bad) LDL and lower c-reactive protein number (bad). I wouldn't worry about c-reactive protein as the number was not significant. Also, "rachial artery testing revealed an inverse correlation between flow-mediated vasodilatation and intake of saturated fat."

Out of the 18 subjects that completed the study (remember, they all went through the 3 diets and 3 wash-out periods), 6 needed caloric adjustment in order to not lose/gain weight (no specific diet mentioned). Some maybe be concerned that subjects were eating more than normal in order to keep the weight. I don't think this is the case, and it is irrelevant as I am interested on the results while NOT losing weight.

I had not read this before but it doesn't look good to me. What do you guys think?
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Online Warren Dew

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Re: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2010, 07:23:52 PM »
I am interested on the results while NOT losing weight.

I had not read this before but it doesn't look good to me. What do you guys think?

I think it's a bad idea to go on a low carb diet and then try not to lose weight.

Inevitably a low carb diet will cause you to lose around 10 pounds of water weight within the first couple of weeks, even if you are not fat to start with.  If you try to make up for that 10 pounds by increasing your food intake, you're going to be eating an unhealthy amount of food.

Offline ajmesa

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Re: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2010, 07:45:41 PM »
I am interested on the results while NOT losing weight.

I had not read this before but it doesn't look good to me. What do you guys think?

I think it's a bad idea to go on a low carb diet and then try not to lose weight.

Inevitably a low carb diet will cause you to lose around 10 pounds of water weight within the first couple of weeks, even if you are not fat to start with.  If you try to make up for that 10 pounds by increasing your food intake, you're going to be eating an unhealthy amount of food.

That is not the case in the study, people in all three diets were eating similar amount of calories. Did you read the full paper?
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Online Warren Dew

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Re: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2010, 08:01:30 PM »
Did you read the full paper?

I just read your post where you said you wanted to ignore important problems with the paper's methodology.  So I gave my feedback while ignoring what you wanted ignored.

Seriously, if you don't want answers, why do you ask questions?
« Last Edit: March 11, 2010, 08:06:17 PM by Warren Dew »

Offline ajmesa

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Re: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2010, 08:06:47 AM »
Did you read the full paper?

I just read your post where you said you wanted to ignore important problems with the paper's methodology.  So I gave my feedback while ignoring what you wanted ignored.
I don't know what post you are referring to. I don't want you, or anyone else, to ignore anything.

I see the problem you mention, but there is no other way to ensure participants do not lose weight. This is a standard procedure that is employed by many, many researchers. This also only happened with 6 participants out of 18, and we don't even know if it happened with the Atkins diet. The study, and the data I am looking for, is not concerned about people who are losing weight but rather people who are maintaining weight. If you have a better study or one that shows the opposite I will be interested in seeing it.

I hope you understand that many of the metabolic changes that happen during weight loss change once weight loss has stopped. How a diet fares while losing weight has nothing to do with the results while maintaining weight.

Seriously, if you don't want answers, why do you ask questions?
Why do you join a DISCUSSION forum if you clearly ignore anything that breaks your current mind set? (I could name but I will not waste my time).
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Online Warren Dew

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Re: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2010, 10:05:45 PM »
I don't know what post you are referring to. I don't want you, or anyone else, to ignore anything.

So you claim ... but you still took pains to say that the study's major methodological flaws were "irrelevant" to what your were interested in.

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I see the problem you mention, but there is no other way to ensure participants do not lose weight.

Sure there is.  Just because you can't think of one doesn't mean there isn't one.  Simply put the study participants on the diet long enough for their weight to stabilize.  That's exactly what happened on the Gardner ATOZ study, which followed 311 participants who were kept on 12 months on their diets - incidentally racking up about 40 times as many actual person months of diet exposure as the study you cite.

That study showed weight loss in the first 6 months, but no significant weight changes in the last 6 months on each diet.  By the end of the study, the participants were in steady state.  That study showed that the Atkins diet was significantly superior to the Ornish diet in HDL-C (good cholesterol) and systolic and diastolic blood pressure, and was not worse in any respect.  A good presentation by the author on the study is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eREuZEdMAVo&feature=player_embedded#

The study itself is here:

http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/jama;297/9/969

I'm sure you'll come up with some reason not to believe it, though, since its findings disagree with your preconceptions.

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Why do you join a DISCUSSION forum if you clearly ignore anything that breaks your current mind set? (I could name but I will not waste my time).

You've got the two of us confused.  It's you that ignores anything that doesn't fit into your preconceptions.

As for me, I've been looking at all the data here since I joined the site, and I've adjusted my beliefs accordingly.  The only reasons I don't overreact to the links you provide the way you do are (1) one tiny 19 person study doesn't carry much weight compared to the many large studies involving hundreds of people that I've already read and absorbed, and (2) I've long since overcome my cultural prejudices about diet, so I'm not suffering from confirmation bias the way you do when you leap desperately at any straw that confirms what you want to believe.

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Re: High saturated fat diet while not losing weight
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2010, 10:05:45 PM »